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Pokémon Diamond, Pearl, and Platinum → Was Cynthia always the champion?

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1. kendowater said on December 7, 2009, 09:49:48 PM (-08:00)

Joltik
17 posts

This might be kinda weird, but fun to think about. I hope I'm posting in the right place!

Was Cynthia always the Champion? She came and helped us a few times but didn't she leave the Elite 4 alone?

If she wasn't the champion, who was the champion before her?

She couldn't be the first champion because the Champion tradition has been going on forever right?

If thats right, why did they never say who the champion was in the previous games (even more on the 1st gen)!

I was just thinking about that...

2. Cat333Pokémon said on December 7, 2009, 10:00:57 PM (-08:00)

Administrator
10,307 posts

I think it might be wise to ask why nobody calls you champion five minutes after you defeat Cynthia. Sure, you get the speech right after, but once the game resets, nobody cares anymore.

3. Serenade said on December 8, 2009, 07:57:39 PM (-08:00)

Volcarona
617 posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat333Pokémon
I think it might be wise to ask why nobody calls you champion five minutes after you defeat Cynthia. Sure, you get the speech right after, but once the game resets, nobody cares anymore.
Well, there was the fan club in ruby and sapphire (Never played emerald, but probably there too) that would start worshiping you if you walked in as the champion.

And maybe everyone else just isn't tuned into the elite 4 challenges. But it is kind of true that no one really cares too much about it.

4. LiteTheIronMan said on December 8, 2009, 09:08:25 PM (-08:00)

Shaymin
2,854 posts

Yeah, in RSE, you'd be famous throughout the continent. In Sinnoh, no one gave a crap.

I think that Cynthia had always been the Champion for the story's purpose, although Frontier Brains might have preceded her.

In RBGY, Blue became the first ever Champion, which is what I'm assuming due to Lance and Blue's reactions.

In GSC, Lance becomes the Champion, but Red is the true Champion, of course. Lance is obviously a placeholder.

In RS, Steven was the Champion. In Emerald, Juan takes Wallace's place in his gym, so it could be assumed that Steven was beaten by Wallace and then went to better himself in Meteor Falls, a la Red. He's arguably a much tougher fight than before in RS, and definitely harder to beat than Wallace is as the Emerald Champ.

5. GreenLiquid said on December 14, 2009, 07:04:17 PM (-08:00)

Regigigas
881 posts

I think the champions are still free to wander around and whatnot, and aren't required to sit tight awaiting challengers at all times. Cynthia, for instance, says that she has a house in some region besides Sinnoh, although it isn't disclosed for security reasons. So I would say that Cynthia was indeed the champion for the entirety of the D/P storyline. Who preceded her is, of course, unknown.

6. Cat333Pokémon said on December 19, 2009, 10:29:56 PM (-08:00)

Administrator
10,307 posts

Remember that Cynthia actually does follow you around throughout the game, notably atop Spear Pillar and in the Distortion World in Platinum.

7. crapgame said on December 19, 2009, 11:19:25 PM (-08:00)

Servine
65 posts

we could also look towards the amine
she is a champion in the entirety of that as well so perhaps its the same in the games case.

8. Will said on December 21, 2009, 10:49:27 PM (-08:00)

Zoroark
252 posts

If you want some reputation get 5 gold stars like me
(All legit Pokedex and proud)

9. Squirtle102 said on December 23, 2009, 09:04:09 AM (-08:00)

Kyurem
2,262 posts

Well if anyone listened at the end Prof. Rowan talks about he was in this room before. So I think he was the champion before Cynthia.

10. Serenade said on December 27, 2009, 03:00:24 AM (-08:00)

Volcarona
617 posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirtle102
Well if anyone listened at the end Prof. Rowan talks about he was in this room before. So I think he was the champion before Cynthia.
Or showed up with another champion.

11. dragonsprout said on December 29, 2009, 12:14:22 AM (-08:00)

Pikachu
6 posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirtle102 View Post
Well if anyone listened at the end Prof. Rowan talks about he was in this room before. So I think he was the champion before Cynthia.
This actually makes sense. According to one of Rowan's assistants, Oak is Rowan's junior in terms of seniority. Now Oak isn't exactly the youngest person in the world, and Rowan already looks pretty old. I'm guessing Rowan was champion before Cynthia and decided to become a Pokemon professor.

Keep in mind that I don't think Cynthia came right after Rowan, if we assume that Rowan was about the main character's age (10-15). This means that he would be in his 50s waiting for someone to beat him.

-Rowan
-1 or 2 champions
-Cynthia

EDIT: forgot, Rowan gave Cynthia her first Pokémon and Pokédex, meaning he couldn't have been champion and professor at the same time!

*shrugs* I sometimes string stories together.

12. Cat333Pokémon said on December 29, 2009, 01:18:33 AM (-08:00)

Administrator
10,307 posts

Hmm, I don't know. It makes sense for the professors to be previous champions. However, there could've been many champions in between them and the current ones, even changing every week or so.

13. GreenLiquid said on December 29, 2009, 11:31:54 AM (-08:00)

Regigigas
881 posts

I think there's some kind of distinction between champion as a rank and champion as a position. Since Red became champion in the first generation games, I suspect that he would still be champion on the G/S games, especially considering the level disparity between his and Lance's Pokémon. What I imagine to be the case is that there is always a 'residing' champion who spends time taking on comers at the League along with the Elite Four, as well as filling some sort of administrative capacity. Yet I don't see it in Red's personality to want to sit around and do that. So if Red was offered the position of residing champion at the League, he probably turned it down in favor of continuing his travels. So maybe he has the 'rank' of champion for winning? I don't know, and I don't think the anime has really touched on the subject in any detail.

As for Cynthia's wanderings, I think from Giovanni and Blue's absences in the first and second generations it's evident that official League trainers don't always have to sit tight.

14. LiteTheIronMan said on December 30, 2009, 10:45:43 PM (-08:00)

Shaymin
2,854 posts

Regarding the professors...

Well, every professor has seen their students inducted, haven't they? Oak saw Red being inducted after he kicked Blue's ass, Birch saw Brendan/May winning to Steven/Wallace, etc. As far as I know, Oak and Rowan are probably the only two that were actually Champions. Agatha (or whoever that old hag is) said Oak was a great Trainer before, and Rowan is apparently Oak's superior when it comes to Pokemon, so those two are probably the only two out of the four that have been in the Pokemon League challenge through and through.

Cynthia probably didn't beat Rowan to earn Champion status though. She probably fought a Frontier Brain or Lucian.

15. GreenLiquid said on December 31, 2009, 09:52:54 AM (-08:00)

Regigigas
881 posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by LiteTheIronMan View Post
Regarding the professors...

Well, every professor has seen their students inducted, haven't they? Oak saw Red being inducted after he kicked Blue's ass, Birch saw Brendan/May winning to Steven/Wallace, etc. As far as I know, Oak and Rowan are probably the only two that were actually Champions. Agatha (or whoever that old hag is) said Oak was a great Trainer before, and Rowan is apparently Oak's superior when it comes to Pokemon, so those two are probably the only two out of the four that have been in the Pokemon League challenge through and through.

Cynthia probably didn't beat Rowan to earn Champion status though. She probably fought a Frontier Brain or Lucian.
Doesn't she have a rivalry with Tycoon Palmer? I don't remember where I got that from, but I think she was seen fighting him somewhere. Maybe she beat him?

16. LiteTheIronMan said on December 31, 2009, 10:16:53 AM (-08:00)

Shaymin
2,854 posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenLiquid View Post
Doesn't she have a rivalry with Tycoon Palmer? I don't remember where I got that from, but I think she was seen fighting him somewhere. Maybe she beat him?
There was a scene in the anime with that. I think it was an intro to one of the more recent movies.

Interestingly, Palmer shares Cynthia's theme in DP. In Platinum he receives the new shiny Frontier Brain theme.

17. kendowater said on January 1, 2010, 07:54:54 PM (-08:00)

Joltik
17 posts

I'm so happy my question got this big!

18. Sphinx said on January 15, 2010, 05:28:58 PM (-08:00)

Floatzel
196 posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenLiquid View Post
I think there's some kind of distinction between champion as a rank and champion as a position.
This is actually a good theory. When you become Champion, you don't sit around and wait for people to come battle you. So Cynthiaosition Champion *insert your character's name here*:Rank Champion
Off topic: I wish you could become something after you become Champion. Take Cynthia's position or become a Gym Leader (That would be AWESOME!).

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